Turtling Rule

Rastlin · Post by **Rastlin** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:28 pm

korragan, cole............ thanks for makeing my point! no one cares about rules if you pick on someone. even if they are commenting on something they have never done.

riddle me this.......why should a new rule just get passed cuz 2, 3 or 4 people think its a good idea?

this should be voted on at pregame meetings wear the pc BASE can have a say! the forum isnt the place for it!!!!!! not everone can be as active as a few of you.

see cole i said some of YOU will say dont play then.

really fun games you got going here GMs. way to go!

seems like the only one players really like is Springhaven!!!

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:37 pm

no, this is voted on by the gms. talkling about it doesn't make it a rule.

celegar · Post by **celegar** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:38 pm

there were several issues this event with shields, its not all about just swinging under or turtling, its about a combination of the two. the situation is that npc's were bent over at the waist and crouched, holding their shield up to the pc's weapon side and swinging at the pc's feet and lower legs.

this is unsafe fighting period, there is no discussion to be had. the npc that is bent over is asking for a headshot or his shield to get bumped thus knocking him to the ground. by swinging for the legs and feet he is endangering the pc with his hits that could potentially knock them over, possibly onto the many pointy sticks that are strewn about the campsite. the use of the shield this way is absolutely turtling as no visible legal target can be seen, and is as such, just as much against the rules as charging, machine gunning, and wrapping are.

(clarification on charging and wrapping. there is no specific distance that players must be apart from each other, there is no need to "have your weapon between you and the other person", you are ONLY charging if you are within arms length of another person. period, anything else is not charging. also, if you arnt charging, then your not wrapping, simple as that. sorry shorties, but you have a smaller target than the big fellas that can hit you on the back shoulder, you just have to be aware and block higher, just as they have to block lower.)

as a side note, if a pc or npc decides to fight bent over, anyone that moves up and fights directly in front of them, within arms reach of them bent over in front is not charging, so any and all shots to their bent over back count, since charging is while standing straight up and within arms reach, not while bent over.

celegar · Post by **celegar** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:44 pm

please stop trolling this topic,

your dislike of the discussion has been noted and your continued language in this manner is beginning to move over into flaming territory.

*Edit* thank you for removing the troll post.

Aurora · Post by **Aurora** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:49 pm

Ok, when did this turn into a kindgergarden playground debate. I thought we were all friends here people.

I think the reason Chris even proposed the idea about turtling is that there were a few npc as Taki stated that were fighing in an unsafe manner using this turtling method. I know from what I heard after the game that they almost tripped a few players which is why Chris, being a GM was trying to fix a problem.

If we can all just have a civil discussion on this topic, that would be great. It's just a proposed idea by a GM for us to discuss as the adults we are who play this game.

BTW all larps are fun in their own way. I had an equally fantastic time at CARPS, FH, and WH this year.

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:51 pm

stop responding to his flames please.

celegar · Post by **celegar** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:57 pm

we could fix this whole thing very simply. instead of swinging we could just point our weapons at whomever we want to hit, then we sould just say a number and a discription of whomever we're hitting. but that might get confusing to say a numeric number, so we'll just use multiples words, like double and triple, to represent two and three.....oh wait, is that from some other game? lol

Rastlin · Post by **Rastlin** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:58 pm

Chris, if people are haveing an issue with the way NPCs are using shields, why should the PCs be punnished? why cant we get a vote on rules? seems like things would run smoother if everyone could vote. than no one is at fault.

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:58 pm

I could go for the swing under a shield. I am less inclined for the other one.

Zeira · Post by **Zeira** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:05 pm

Serenity shoots people too!!! But I digress...

I do think we should take some time to show the newer people how to use a shield. It doesn't have to be a rule, I just think it would lower the amount of accidents. The event before last Sam was bashed in the face with a shield during a battle. And yeah the knee bend is kinda impractical. Just a thought.

Post by **GM-Mike** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:06 pm

Um...wow. I don't even know what to say. I guess I would start with: you can't turtle at CARPS either, at least that's my understanding. I don't understand why anyone would be against a rule meant to protect players. My number one priority in running this game is safety. Fun is a distant second. Way distant.

Now, to imply only NPCs are guilty of turtling makes me want to hurl. I think this is generally a good rule to discuss because to swing under your shield (and we're talking about larger shields here), you either need to be raise your shield up and risk hitting your opponent in the face (which happened to me twice at this last event, neither one of which was appreciated) or you have to be bent over and attacking the ankles which is unsafe for everyone involved (which happened multiple times to me at the previous event.)

We all do things, NPCs and PCs alike, that are unsafe in combat. Having rules is how we correct each other's behavior.

Now, does anyone have anything constructive to say? Non-constructive posts will be deleted from here on out. A continuance of inappropriate behavior may result in having all active FH accounts terminated. We appreciate all constructive feedback. Simply stating how stupid we all are does not fit into this mold and does not constitute appropriate forum behavior or decorum. Changing user names to continue non-constructive bashing will result in termination from FH. This goes for GMs of other chapters.

Thank you.

celegar · Post by **celegar** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:10 pm

could one of the gm's critique my post on charging definitions please, if there is anything at all with how i understand the rules i would like to know immidiately because what i posted is how i understand charging, machine gunning, and wrapping.

General Maximus · Post by **General Maximus** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:11 pm

The current charging rule is 2 feet, but an arm length is about 2 feet so it works well!

And yes if a person is bent over and they get hit on the back, than they will get hit on the back. But if people are standing correctly, than back hits from the front should not be happening.

Bottom line folks. Stand up while fighting and do not fight on your knees or from the ground. Keep this in mind and you should be safe. It is when you are on the ground ankel bitting is when you can get hurt.

And always keep an eye on your target. If you can not see them, than don't swing. So if you head is behind a shield, not seing, it's not safe.

The biggest issue I have run across with shields is folks leading with there hands and hitting my shield when I raise it up and out to block. Weapons should always come first not hands

Once a new person is shown how to safely use a shield, turtling goes a way. So new players ask the old vet's on how to use a shield in FH. I know many people will be gald to help you out. Think of safety first. If there is a question, don't swing. Stay off of the ground, stand and fight, and all will be safe!!

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:12 pm

I do get shield bashed alot by the newer pcs. Taking time to show them would be good. and the other PCs can take that time. I'd almost rather see a safe fighting training done IN GAME. new pcs who do it get a hero point, and the older pc's who train it, get something. (and a refresher when their doing it.)

celegar · Post by **celegar** » Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:15 pm

id like to note that crouching can also, potentially, be dangerous, as your legs are splayed out and your upper body is lower(thus making your head a more presentable target). however, under the current rules crouching is allowed. the reasoning i see behind this is that you can still move around and stand up safely while crouched or in any low to ground stance. is this valid?