spell books/potion boooks and craftman books

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 4:05 am

actually it does comply with in game mechanics. that's what I've been saying.

"Locks
A locking mechanism can be placed on any door or opening. This locking mechanism must be
physically represented and tagged by using an actual lock. This lock only symbolizes a locking
mechanism and not what the mechanism looks like. A door with no locking mechanism is
assumed to be locked by sliding a bar which can be slid open in no time by a person on the inside
or if no one is inside, then the door is assumed to be unbarred."

OPENING. You can lock a chest, therefore you can lock a book.

"ot everything that is plausible is possible, and vice versa. In real life if there is a door/chest etc. with a lock on it I could use a hammer to whack at the lock. In game we cant, thats why we are limited to a)picking time, and b)breaking time. "

that's my exact argument.

EDIT:
And we are forgetting a very important notion. the mechanic and the rp of the device are separated. my spell book COULD be a box of ants that spell out the spells on command. *LOL*

in conclusion, the very mechanic that allows a treasure chest to be locked, makes you able to lock your spell book.

Todd · Post by **Todd** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:18 am

I hear what you are saying, but speaking for myself [as a GM] at not as FH as a whole, I disagree.

Doors and openings (including chests, windows, safes, etc) can be locked. A book, pouch, pocket, etc do not qualify do to the fact that there is nothing to attach said lock to.

In order to make such a thing you would have to research a way to reinforce the object in question to the point that it could support a lock.

Aurora · Post by **Aurora** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:59 am

So basically if one knows a master craftsman they can have them research doing something like that, yes?

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:28 am

but Todd, what if it's not a spell book? what if it's a box of ants?

We don't design mechanics for individual items, they are for entire general groups. I could just say my spell book is a box. or a book shaped box with a spell book in it.

Todd · Post by **Todd** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:23 am

You answered your own question. If its a 'box' with a book in it then it already falls under the rules for locked containers. Tag the box, tag the lock. Book goes inside.

If you want to lock the 'book' under the premise that you can lock ANY opening, then you must craft said device that would allow it.

The rules say 'Door or Opening'. Ive already explained what constitutes an 'opening'.

To make it clearer (though a bit risque') a good example of why you cannot just throw a lock on anything you deem and 'opening' is the Chastity Belt.
An opening that cannot be locked. You can however create a device the inhibits its opening. If it makes you feel better think of your box of ants in a chastity belt. Only way to preserve the 'innocence' of your 'box'.

*sorry to anyone who might be offended.

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:46 am

Another aspect is that with a box of ant, you spellbook isn't the box, it's the ants. The box is a container for said spell book. I mean you could a bag of ants too. Or handful of ants if the spells were loose. Neither the hand or bag could be locked. Again, I have no issue with a specialty type lock to lock up spell/crafting/potion books. It would be specific and neat, but could just as easily be done with a small container.

And technically the rulebook only refers to doors and openings. A chest isn't an opening, nor is it a door by any conventional intereptations of the words. So locks are allowed on boxes and chests by GM descretion only (and Todd has clarified opening for game purposes).

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:48 am

If that is the case, I will need a post in the rule update section changing the wording of opening to explicitly state what it can and can not lock. Until then, I am forced to use the exact wording.

opening:a void in solid matter; a gap, hole, or aperture.

this means any tagged item,that has a hole, or lid may be locked. until the wording is changed, that is how I am going to have to rule. (at least for WH.)

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:54 am

If you are using the exact wording then it's pretty blatant that spellbooks and the like cannot be locked. A spellbook is not an opening.

And yes neither is a chest. However, ignoring a lock on a chest is fairly cheese considering it is a long standing unwritten rule. Technically a chest can have an opening, but is not one itself so you could go that route. However a book has no opening as there is no void when it is opened (it's not holow).

Peace420 · Post by **Peace420** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:55 am

I agree with Travis. Some people can't even read and they can cast a ritual or do alchemy. If a door has a break time then a spell book would too. Most chests couldn't stand up to a militay hammer at all, they would be crushed open with one swing so to say you could just cut a book open at the binding is exactly the same thing. Most locks couldn't either, one hand held battering ram or military hammer busts door locks like they were made of paper mache, the popo do it everyday on COPS so it must be true.

If it's an IG item, you should be able to lock it, just like a door, or a chest. It seems like the assumption is that all doors and chests are sturdy and designed and built well enough that they can all be locked and prevent people from just getting around the lock. (Hinges, prying it open, etc.)

Here's another question, a container, would you be able to lock that? If not why not? If so then why wouldn't you be able to lock a book?

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:57 am

opening:a void in solid matter; a gap, hole, or aperture.

how is that NOT a spell book?

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:58 am

Doors and chests have in-game costs to make them. Spellbooks do not.

Peace420 · Post by **Peace420** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:59 am

Containers don't. Atleast not the basic one which is as big as a small chest or backpack.

cole45 · Post by **cole45** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 11:02 am

doesn't matter if they have a cost. They have a tag. They are real, they interact with other tagged items.

ap·er·ture Audio Help (āp'ər-chər) Pronunciation Key
n.

1. An opening, such as a hole, gap, or slit.
2.
1. A usually adjustable opening.

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 11:10 am

Class 1 containers are backbacks, satchels and burlap sacks. Locking any one them would be dumb. They exist so people with backpacks can carry more stuff than those without.

So could you lock your sword then? It has a tag. And when moved it creates a void where it was too. What about armor? Could you lock the head hole? Armor has lots of openings... Seriously.

You asked, and (as a GM which is rare for him), Todd answered. Let it go. And don't be a dick on the pronouciation crap.

Peace420 · Post by **Peace420** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 11:15 am

Class 1 container is a size with examples in the book I believe.

I can't believe you of all people pulled the "don't be a dick and just take what the GM has said" card.