The whole point of the rule is so a person doesnt dye some white cloth leather color rap it onto their head in a bonnit and call it a helmet.
We simply better designed the rule so helmets give 1 exta soak for those people that try to do something a little more real.
That is all
new helmet rules
Moderator: Admin
Yes but now all empaths should be running around in heavy helms (or real light) and wearing medium breastplates. Somehow I don't think that was the intention. The added benefit of this change is more beneficial to people not wearing heavy armor, since 10 armor is impossible wearing a heavy or light helm. Honestly, no one should wear a medium helm except a fully armored warrior (and even then a heavy is better). Why not just adjust the overall armor totals down and remove armor points from helms entirely?
And the coverage and material grouped together doesn't work completely either. The two should be considered seperately if you are going to factor them in. I mean a hardened leather skullcap is hardly the same as a full hardened mask. You have effectively 3 coverage areas and 3 materials. add up your total and divide by 3 and you have your category. With this rule, I'd be 2 * 3 (2 locations at 3 points per), thus medium. Nelkie would be 3 * 1 (3 locations at 1 point), thus also medium. However, I only need to add a leather mask to gain heavy, whereas he needs a whole new helm.
And since Mike brought it up
, as with the assassin change, who was complaining about the helmet rules?
sorry my detailing took long but was busy.
And the coverage and material grouped together doesn't work completely either. The two should be considered seperately if you are going to factor them in. I mean a hardened leather skullcap is hardly the same as a full hardened mask. You have effectively 3 coverage areas and 3 materials. add up your total and divide by 3 and you have your category. With this rule, I'd be 2 * 3 (2 locations at 3 points per), thus medium. Nelkie would be 3 * 1 (3 locations at 1 point), thus also medium. However, I only need to add a leather mask to gain heavy, whereas he needs a whole new helm.
And since Mike brought it up
, as with the assassin change, who was complaining about the helmet rules?sorry my detailing took long but was busy.
My posts in no way reflect that of anyone else nor are they in any way official.
heh, I just noticed that too.
So chain is heavy and medium? (just noticed it exists in both in the armor types section)
and wow, leather is medium...
noting this Aaron's helm would be the same level of protection as mine under the numbers I played with.
So chain is heavy and medium? (just noticed it exists in both in the armor types section)
and wow, leather is medium...
noting this Aaron's helm would be the same level of protection as mine under the numbers I played with.
My posts in no way reflect that of anyone else nor are they in any way official.
Im confused and i dont want to look it up.
Are we basing armor/armor penalties based on total armor points or by what ever it is called.
Forexample, quality aside, if I can find a way to get 10 AP's but somehow call it light then it is light because it is called light vs heavy because it is 10 points.
Are we basing armor/armor penalties based on total armor points or by what ever it is called.
Forexample, quality aside, if I can find a way to get 10 AP's but somehow call it light then it is light because it is called light vs heavy because it is 10 points.
Chris
I be one of the gamemasters so e-mail me questions if you have them
I be one of the gamemasters so e-mail me questions if you have them
NO! The book states the following about armor catagory:
Armor categories are based on the maximum total armor points received from the armor a character is wearing; thus, your armor category does not decrease as your armor points are depleted in combat. The only way to reduce your armor category is to remove the physical representation of your armor.
Suits or partial suits of armor that provide between one (1) and four (4) armor points are considered to be in the "Light" category, between five (5) and seven (7) armor points is considered to be in the "Medium" armor category, and finally, suits of armor that provide eight (8) or more points are in the Heavy category.
Armor categories are based on the maximum total armor points received from the armor a character is wearing; thus, your armor category does not decrease as your armor points are depleted in combat. The only way to reduce your armor category is to remove the physical representation of your armor.
Suits or partial suits of armor that provide between one (1) and four (4) armor points are considered to be in the "Light" category, between five (5) and seven (7) armor points is considered to be in the "Medium" armor category, and finally, suits of armor that provide eight (8) or more points are in the Heavy category.
Last edited by WayneO42 on Fri Apr 06, 2007 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Wayne O
The Game Master Lite
Frag the weak, Hurdle the dead!
The Game Master Lite
Frag the weak, Hurdle the dead!
Yes. Tighter weave would be heavy and looser weave would be mediumSo chain is heavy and medium? (just noticed it exists in both in the armor types section)
Hardened leather is in medium. Suede and such doesnt count. It should be atleast 9oz leatherand wow, leather is medium...
Wayne O
The Game Master Lite
Frag the weak, Hurdle the dead!
The Game Master Lite
Frag the weak, Hurdle the dead!
Yeah I started to think I missed a vote or something. Glad to see it is done correctly.
All helms have always and forever yielded 1 AP thus light armor goes from 1-4 and not 3.
Now helms have a potential soak of 2 based on if they are real or not and their strength.
Combat reflexes(CF's) is better than armor points (AP) since CF's can be healed by ANYONE and no extra skill is requiered.
So if we look at the chart. The following all give 1 soak which is EXACTLY how much soak it gave before.
Real light (1 soak, but cannot stop posion...dissadvantage)
Fake Medium (Same as the old rules)
Fake Heavy (Same as the old rules no skill needed to repair)
The following yield a bonus
Real medium
Real Heavy
Both of these give 1 LP as they probably should.
So um I am still not understanding the problem. Is it the definition as to what constitutes what? If you want to walk around with a barbute physrep and call it light armor mechanically that is cool with me. If you want to walk around with a cloth bonnett and call it a real heavy Barbute I am not. Seems simple.
All helms have always and forever yielded 1 AP thus light armor goes from 1-4 and not 3.
Now helms have a potential soak of 2 based on if they are real or not and their strength.
Combat reflexes(CF's) is better than armor points (AP) since CF's can be healed by ANYONE and no extra skill is requiered.
So if we look at the chart. The following all give 1 soak which is EXACTLY how much soak it gave before.
Real light (1 soak, but cannot stop posion...dissadvantage)
Fake Medium (Same as the old rules)
Fake Heavy (Same as the old rules no skill needed to repair)
The following yield a bonus
Real medium
Real Heavy
Both of these give 1 LP as they probably should.
So um I am still not understanding the problem. Is it the definition as to what constitutes what? If you want to walk around with a barbute physrep and call it light armor mechanically that is cool with me. If you want to walk around with a cloth bonnett and call it a real heavy Barbute I am not. Seems simple.
Chris
I be one of the gamemasters so e-mail me questions if you have them
I be one of the gamemasters so e-mail me questions if you have them
Wayne, true, but the oz wieght isn't. Which brings up the question of is unhardened 10oz leather light or medium? Would 6oz hardened be medium or light? Hardened and light are vague for someone not reading this thread.
Chris,
light armor is 1-4, med 5-7 and heavy is 8-10.
helms are nothing, 1 armor, or 1 combat reflexes (life is irrelevant)
so using an empath (max 4 armor):
their best option is heavy helm + medium chest + light legs and arms.
using a med helm, they'd lose a combat reflexes. (and have light chest)
using light, they'd still only lose the combat reflexes. (and have med chest)
now heavy warrior:
best is heavy all around. (and only use 9 armor)
med helm drops the cr to armor (maxing them at the 10 armor)
light they lose the armor (having 9 armor)
So while the concept almost of works for the heavy warrior, it doesn't for every other combination.
Chris,
light armor is 1-4, med 5-7 and heavy is 8-10.
helms are nothing, 1 armor, or 1 combat reflexes (life is irrelevant)
so using an empath (max 4 armor):
their best option is heavy helm + medium chest + light legs and arms.
using a med helm, they'd lose a combat reflexes. (and have light chest)
using light, they'd still only lose the combat reflexes. (and have med chest)
now heavy warrior:
best is heavy all around. (and only use 9 armor)
med helm drops the cr to armor (maxing them at the 10 armor)
light they lose the armor (having 9 armor)
So while the concept almost of works for the heavy warrior, it doesn't for every other combination.
My posts in no way reflect that of anyone else nor are they in any way official.
Ok I understand. The emapth can squeeze out 2 more soak than they could previously.
I dont care. It is a non issue. If and empath wants to run around in a 12 pound barbute and throw packets I welcome it completely.
Wow that is alot of pages on something that is not an issue
I dont care. It is a non issue. If and empath wants to run around in a 12 pound barbute and throw packets I welcome it completely.
Wow that is alot of pages on something that is not an issue
Chris
I be one of the gamemasters so e-mail me questions if you have them
I be one of the gamemasters so e-mail me questions if you have them
Truthfully I could almost see the logic if you just gave an extra life to the real category and maybe take away the fake light protection(although I think the effort is actually worth something especially in a game that makes you phys rep as much as this one meaning it costs you $$ to phys rep things). But what you've done is made even a fake heavy better than a real med becaue it no longer counts against your armor category at all. There are quite a few disciplines and half of the paths have armor restrictions.
Funny, it seemed like a non issue until the change. Wasn't broken but got "fixed".
Funny, it seemed like a non issue until the change. Wasn't broken but got "fixed".
Death=Adder
One of these days...I'm going to cut you into little pieces...
~Pink Floyd~
One of these days...I'm going to cut you into little pieces...
~Pink Floyd~