Druid Discussion and Balance of Value...

[dier_cire]

Like I said, the story above is how I see it working. Its the Mechanics that are the snag.

Thus why we butt heads. I deal in mechanics alone. Story can be made up later.

and honestly I don't care where the shifting thing happens. Just an idea. The reason I moved it was in an effort to solve the "what skills can one use" thing. As for the 4th level powers, I made them all existing 4th level powers (and claws), so there is no under powering (granted this assumes use of all skills in animal/monster form).

And yeah, I know people want variety, but that variety causes the problems. Keep the variety simple and you lower the chance of questions and issues. Just because you don't have a special skill, doesn't mean you aren't a special character.

By the way, I'd love to see 2.0 mow people down with claws. Dual short sword is overrated. Especially considering a person can't call damage as fast as they can swing.

And Liedel, that's just cause you sold your soul to be able to do that.

[Tonia Glowski]

For the love of Pete, please do not allow aquatic totems. There's nothing worse than seeing a walking Land Shark to ruin my shaky suspension of disbelief.

[dier_cire]

"Candy gram"

[Todd]

Dont worry. If we allow equatics I think that they are allowed to be played as long as they can keep their head under water. If they come out of the water they have to keep a fishbowl over their head.

Oh and the fishbowl has to be full

[Todd]

Oh one more thing. Dont let Liedel fool you. He aint that good.

ask him how long his dual weilding flesh golum lasted.

[Kale]

Less than 10 seconds.

Funny that, that was what I was counting to since I was in a root

[dier_cire]

pwned

[Nelkie]

Man, go off line for a weekend and have a novel to read when I get back.

The flight / fight response works for me. Personal I would be wolf with resit effect/flee and be the best scout around. I can scout, and get out of a dangerous situation, get help, transform and come back in human form to destory my enimies.

But in alarp all skills must be defined and not up to inturpation. In a sit down RP it works becasue you have 1 personmaking all the descisions. In a larp you have many people making the desciosns and the descions will change from one person to another. That is why the rules need to very specific and straight foward. Both the NPc & PC know what can and can't be done. Also when one has to stop the game to ask an NPC "whilein my animal form can I do this ....." it slows the game , and makes everyone wait while the descison is debated upon by 3 NPC's. (It has happened to me to many times to count) That is why I want it defined in the rules what mechincal advantage the 4th level druid gets. If it is not in the rules, than the druid can't do it. Keep it simple. This is what I have gleamed from the conersation to date.

30 secounds to change froms
No speach
No skills
No equipment
While in animal form all equipment is absored into body
Change back to human form when unconious
Animal will be same size as the person
loose any armor benifits
Have base life, costume, buffs (life,armor, resits, +5 damage swing) while in animal form

Can use all druid abilites while in animal form (including root because root is a mental/msagical control over plants) note root is a 10 secound count to break free period, it does not matter if the person is gertting hit or not, they still are free after 10 secs.
Get animal special ability
Get claws (18") or the flee skill as per scout
Get to diguse onself as an animal
Can communicate with like animal while in animal form
Can still pick items up

What do people think?

[Peace420]

Going backwards because that's how they are at the bottom.

Aaron, I don't think anyone has suggested that if you are in animal form you can still pick stuff up, it's doesn't make sense but for balancing reasons I don't think it overpowers the skill at all. I can see the root being usable in animal form, it does create the root, dual machine gunned claws thing but I think having the shorter claws balances that.

What about the escaping bonds? I don't see any discussion on the last page. I am on the fence on this one, It does makes sense for some animals but not for others.

I don't really see much to be interpreted in the skill, you get what you get and that's it, it's really easier than the other skills since you already know that you cannot combine any skill otutside of the druid discipline.

Ried, the only variety would be in the 1 skill that you get for your totem animal (plus possibly Fight or Flight). I don't think that makes for alot of if any confusion since you can't use any non druid skills. I disagree with your assesment of dual shorts in this game since you can call 1 pretty fast, at CARPS that may be true but at FH you can call just a # with no postscript. I also obviously agree with Todd, you work out a really good sound concept and then make the mechanics fit the concept, The story needs to fit the game and setting.

What are you guys talking about, a land shark would be the coolest thing ever!! You could... oh hell I can't even type that crap.

1.0, I agree but it's way too hard to police machine gunning and it is one of the only advantages to having a short weapon, the other being concealability.

I like the Flight or Flight choice, it gives the pacifist character a skill that is useful in place of the claws.

[Dallid]

Comparing Emulate Totem to other fourth level abilities is comparing apples to oranges - no other ability costs you speech and all other path/discipline skills.

I don't think the druid skills should be a given for any animal (nothing, really, should be a given).

A lion, elephant, or rhino would have some nifty combat abilities, but won't be fast moving through the wilderness - no wilderness survival.

I agree, carnivores should be hunters, herbavoirs - runners. But nothing set in stone. Different animals would have different abilites. Many would be combinations of fight-or-flee and of varying levels.

A single wolf is pretty laughable in a fight. However, he'd likely have a pack of mates backing him up. A charging rhino on the other hand is a small army unto itself. The wolf, however, may have the flee ability while the rhino doesn't (a pure animal war machine).

Likewise, if threatened, a mole or rat would disappear into the brush (hide/burrow). A deer would run like the wind (flee). Likely none of these would have any form of attack.

A dog might strike at a minor foe (weak attack), but would run like mad from anything else (flee again).

A horse might run from a fight (flee yet again), or might rear up and stomp down with his hooves, or kick out with his rear legs (Crush attack with 3-5 count charge up time - no other form of attack)

Basically I feel no hard-set catagory of rules can work here. Each character and each totem ought to be custom built. The player then carries his totem characteristics at all times for reference.

[Nelkie]

My first attempt on Elmate Totem was this

I would not transform, but take on some characterisitcs of the animal

Wolf
1-2 harnden skin - Wolf's ability to dodge around, and being hardy
Press - animal strength
+3 to backstab - Hamstringing, a famous wolf attack

Add to gather the levels of skills add up to 3-4. The NPC's did not like the idea of 1 skill granting many smaller skills. No problem.

But I do not like the idea of making specilized skills for each totem. A standard set of rules needs to drawn up and implemented. Haivng an amorphose skill in game cna lead to problems and possible rule breaks. Keep it simple. Not to mention the NPC's are busy with writing up plots, etc.. I don;t want to add another thing onto their to do list.

[Dallid]

I also think weapon phys-rep length and number should depend on the relative attack ability of the animal. A wolf or dog, short. A bear or rhino, medium. A horse, long (infrequent attacks with significant reach).

Wolves might get two phys-reps, as they tend to bite and rend and generally go crazy. Bears tend not to do combo attacks (SWAT! Still alive? SWAT again. Still alive? BITE), so only one phys-rep. Basically chose a weapon size and number (and weather or not they can block attacks) that best represents the animal's style of fighting.

[Dallid]

How many Druids are there? The NPCs all ready must take time out to confer, plan, and scheme with PCs who interact with NPCs. They generally are happy to spend time with each of us individually, when necessary, to resolve events. This is no different.

Once they decide how to handle Druids, the actually time they'll spend on totems (if they still exist) shouldn't be more than 5-10 minutes per druid.

[dier_cire]

Comparing Emulate Totem to other fourth level abilities is comparing apples to oranges - no other ability costs you speech and all other path/discipline skills.

Then why should druid have it? Unfortunately, this description is the reason I say toss the idea all together. If no other skill has it, then probably no skill should have it.

I think the gaining a few animal traits is fine, but those traits must be listed and no others are ever added. Once the list of choices is written, it's done. If you want to be a rooster and it's not an option, well, tough luck. Granted, this is why I went with generalizations, so people would still feel they could do anything. I'd still prefer even animal traits to stay within the 4th level skills since they are far easier to deal with.

[WayneO42]

Ok, I am finally going to weight in on the druid debate. I think we should get rid of emulate totem and make it its own discipline. For fourth level druid I like the pacify animal skill. It creates another call but it is really only a call NPCs need to worry about (Like the undead slayer's Banish call). Here are my ideas for the discipline:

Druid – savage, common
The druid is in tune with the savage and wild world. The plants and animals are his allies and his source of knowledge.

Level 1: Wilderness Survival
Allows more rapid travel through the wilderness (1/2 time), the finding of food, and a lower chance of dangerous encounters in-between events. Get one free food token, and one free hide token per event. These tokens can be traded as normal tokens.

Level 2: No Movement Restrictions
The druid cannot be slowed by any effect that hampers movement, such as root, slick, etc.

Level 3: Magic Root
This packet-driven ability takes 15 seconds to charge, during which time the druid cannot perform any other actions, including moving. The druid must hit the target with the packet and call “Magic Root.”

Level 4: Pacify Animal
This packet-driven ability takes 5 seconds to charge, during which time the druid cannot perform any other actions, including moving. The druid must hit the target with the packet and call “Pacify Animal.”. A pacified animal will not attack. If a pacified animal is approached by anyone other than the druid, it will flee. If a pacified animal is attacked, the animal will defend itself and the pacify is broken. A druid may communicate with a pacified animal if the druid is the one who pacified it. Note: Not all animals will communicate with the druid even if pacified. The personality and behavior of the animal is up to the discretion of the GM/NPC staff.


Beastling – savage, common
The beastling is at home in the wild, so much so that it is sometimes difficult to tell them apart from one of the beasts that roam Phanterra. Note: Upon taking this discipline, the beastling must declare a “Totem” animal.

Level 1: Enhanced senses The beastling’s senses are as keen as an animals. This skill allows the beastling to reduce the time it takes to find hidden items. It also reduces the time it takes to conduct basic searches in half.

Level 2: Partial transformation
The beastling’s bond with their totem has grown so strong that the beastling can now partially assume its form. It takes an uninterrupted 30 count to change forms. While changed, the beastling gains some of the physical characteristics of their totem, however, their physical size does not change. While transformed, the beastling may fight (strike and block) with dagger sized claws. The beastling may not use any other skill while transformed that requires fine manipulation (Pick locks, alchemy, set/disarm traps, etc. If you could not perform the skill while holding claw phys reps you cannot use the skill while transformed.)

Level 3: Minor Transformation
The beastling gains the “Minor” ability of their totem animal while transformed. See the chart below for a list of totems and their minor ability. The beastling may not use any other skill while transformed that requires fine manipulation (Pick locks, alchemy, set/disarm traps, etc. If you could not perform the skill while holding claw phys reps you cannot use the skill while transformed.) The beastling also begins to permanently take on the behavioral traits of their totem animal.

Level 4: Major Transformation
The beastling gains the “Major” ability of their totem animal while transformed. See the chart below for a list of totems and their major ability. The beastling may now fight with shortsword sized claws while transformed. The beastling may not use any other skill while transformed that requires fine manipulation (Pick locks, alchemy, set/disarm traps, etc. If you could not perform the skill while holding claw phys reps you cannot use the skill while transformed.) The beastling also permanently takes on some of the physical traits of their totem animal.

Totem Chart Ideas (As in not finished. As in needs work. As in dont dwell on the skills yet, critique the concept)
Totem...Minor Skill...Major Skill
Wolf...+3 backstab...Flee
Bear...Press...Maul: 5 count to do 3 crush
Snake...Scales: 3 Hardened Skin...1LP to “bite” for 1 vorpal Poison 2