Real Armor question

[GM_Chris]

Hey guys anyone see any loophole withthe following idea.

"Real Armor does not have to be taken off to be repaired.

Real Helm does not have to be taken off when armor is reduced to 0."

Chris

[Peace420]

Clear definition of real. Would that mean that the helm would still protect from stun strike?

[Nelkie]

As eric said, what is considered real. The only cheese factor I see is people running around with a real helemt with zero armor points so they can be protected from stun strike.

[GM_Chris]

Dont worry what is real..just want to know what you guys think of the small tidbit listed.

Chris

[Midnight]

Again I must ask the question, why should people who can afford better costuming OOG, gain benefits because of it IG? That's like saying "People who buy the latex swords from Rampent Mouse now have +1 to their damage."

[WayneO42]

Your analogy does not hold because of the encumberance of real armor. Latex weapons look better and weild a little easier but they in no way hinder a user. Real armour is heavy, hard to move in, and requires practice to use so it should be given some sort of bonus. We want to encourage people to wear real armor or at the least good looking armour because it increases a players emersion into the game and the storyline. Why would I wear plate armour that weights 40 pounds instead of cardboard armour?

Also, the bonuses given are not that major if you are not wearing real armour. How long does it take to remove hockey pads? 2 minutes? As a comparison, it took three people 5-10 minutes to suit Chris up in full plate when he was playing the dwarf. It took longer to take off the armour and put it back on than it did for a craftsman to repair the armour. The bonus alleviates that.

[Peace420]

If the helm idea means that you can resist stun strike with 0 armor (didn't really get an answer as far as I can tell) then I'm absolutely against that . The real armor thing is totally different IMO. That one takes away some of the disadvantage of wearing real armor, and while a real helm may be heavier, it is just as easy to get off.

[Midnight]

I think my point was missed. You are considering rewarding those who can afford real armor, or on the flip side, penalizing people who can not. Why would anyone want to play a game where those who have more money OOG get better benefits IG? Believe me, it's not just your game where I have a problem with this. People who can afford to buy costuming at Ren Fair, or latex swords at Rampent Mouse, or real armor shouldn't get benefits just because they choose to do so.

[GM_Chris]

Well honestly when we started the game we talked about enforcing a policy of dress that frankly we are not atm.

Now I am not talking alot of money...this is a fantasy game LARP and requieres a person to wear more than jeans as they would to a sit down game. Our game is cheaper than EVER other LARP out there if you add up all the requierments.

You can make yourself real armor fairly cheaply. You can learn to make chain. There are MANY things a person can do.

Now as for real helms..yes they come off easier so we will look into it but heck a plate barbute is so heavy you cany wear it all the time anyways!

Chris

[GM_Chris]

As wayne said we are not giving an advantage as much as we are tring to remove a penalty. Currently those in real armor are penalized for it and that is why no one does it. Reid told me this and frankly I didnt believe him until I tried it. Those with real armor get mad looking at people wearing plastic.

Chris

[Midnight]

I guess it doesn't really matter what people's financial situation is then, does it? I can tell you now, I do not have the finances to sink into real armor. Nor do I have the time to make chain. I'm much too busy running a household single-handed, on top of working full time, larping in 2 games, running a table top, as well as other extra-curricular activities, not to mention doing this all on only one full-time income. Are you going to do it for me? I find it amazing that we are even able to make it to the game at all. Whether or not you are one of the cheapest larps around doesn't really make a difference when you start talking about rewarding people who do have the money to sink into expensive and/or time consuming costuming/props.

Right now, paying the mortgage is more important. I think it's great that people are willing to be realistic enough to buy real armor, but I don't think it should be enforced in *any* way, including those that reward the people that do. The rest of us, as a general majority, do the best we can with what we have. That should be enough. That goes for any minimum costume requirements in general.

Of all the things that have been talked about in this game for OOG mechanics, this is the one thing I have ever felt so strongly about as to post repeatedly on, on multiple threads. That should really give you an idea of how I feel about it. I can tell you now, SoCo feels the same way, but he doesn't have the time to read all of these posts; he needs to concentrate on his school work.

[Nelkie]

I would suggest getting rid of real helmets can be keep on. Becasue in the rules right now you could make a quality helemet that would not raise your armor category at all and still protect you against stun strike.

As for not having to take off real armor to be repair is fair and does not even come close on negating the weight and bulkiness of real armor.

[Peace420]

Chris, very true on the barbute and weight but my point is that they would never need to spend resources to "fix" it for 1 pt when it's main use which is protection from stun and nerve pinch would always be there.

Nat, I think they see your concern, and I have the same concerns for rewarding people that have extra $$ to spend on spiffy stuff. But that isn't what they are proposing. They are simply trying to level the playing field so to speak. Wayne and Chris have pointed out that real armor is not only much much heavier but that it takes much much more time and sometimes 2 or more people to take off and put on. So a field repair on the hockey pad warrior would take maybe 12-15 minutes including removal and redonning of the armor. Whereas just the removal and redonning of real armor can take that long or more. There is no numerical or real mechanical benefit in what they are proposing for the armor, you don't get a better category or more protection. I don't know, maybe it's just something that you have to actually experience to understand.

[GM_Chris]

Thanks Eric very well put.

As for the helm thing thanks for pointing out the super cheez of never repair it.

Chris



On a side note most everyone has limited wealth and time to decide what they want to do with it. Having requirements to play or do any activity is a fact of life. A person who wants to take a martial art and tells the instructor that they cannot afford the proper armor would not be able to participate. A person who wants to scuba dive without the actual gear would drown. Now we at FH are trying very hard to stay in the middle. We want people to be able to play cheaply, but at the same time we want to make sure the atmosphere remains conducive to LARP emersion. This means people should not wear jeans, they should have elf ears if they want to play an elf, they should not wear a bandana and call it a helm. Now I know as a GM staff we do alot of these things, but we are moving in a direction to remove as much of the bad as possible. The sad fact is we cannot accommodate everything, for example we cannot play in a parking lot outside Wal-Mart so people in wheel chairs have an easier time.

[Dallid]

Right. I've always had a strong opinion that extra OOG time and money should not equal in-game benefits. But what Chris is proposing isn't providing a benefit to those wearing real armor - it's lessening a disadvantage. A crippling disadvantage, at that.

Not only does it take a long time (and even multiple people) to don or remove metal armor, it's a thoroughly exhausting process, as well. I know if I was wearing full plate and had to remove my armor to get it repaired, my armor would never get repaired during an event - getting it off and on is just too much.

Also, the fighter in fake armor will go through the repair process in 20 minutes. Why should it take the fighter with real armor and the same armor points an hour to do the same? And while my character doesn't wear armor, I wouldn't want to be stuck for an hour after a skirmish waiting for a fighter to remove his armor, get it repaired, and get it back on again.