Progression

Lao · Post by **Lao** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 12:57 pm

The only change I would like to see is for characters to start at 1st level and have those 50 pts to spend. I really felt somewhat limited during character creation and while those 50pts dont amount to a whole lot, they do allow for a little more ability when coming into the game.

You just add in the rule that after your 1st event you are a 4th level character and gain 4 levels per event after that.

Aside from that I like most of the progression (although havent really seen the high end yet, so cant say for sure).

Lambic · Post by **Lambic** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 2:52 pm

Speaking as a new arrival with little to no LARP experience:

Did I feel involved?

Kind of. I sort of forced my way into a few situations. In fact there were times that Lambic felt very much like the "new guy in town." I think I might have felt more involved if I was a more combat oriented character right off the bat or if I had been able to stay the whole event.

Did I feel useful?

Not really. I didn't really feel like what I was doing was adding up to much. However, in reflection I'm not sure that that is true, but that is definitely how I felt. An example of this is when I spent all morning brewing a two level 1 potions, tracked down a GM to give me tokens for them, and then passed them out to somebody, who was thankful for them. I then watched them buy a stack of potions of a higher level than mine off of an NPC. As I underdstand it many of those potions are now gone. My two potions felt very ineffectual, although I don't really know how true that was.

Now on the the next question, what would fix this?

Would starting higher level help?

I don't know. Maybe. I don't really think it would hurt. You are still in need of other people. You aren't really that much more of a threat to anyone, level 3 abilities are nice but not so much of a threat unless combined with other abilities. But would it have made Lambic feel more useful? Maybe in his special case but its a tough call. Pretty close to 50/50 on that one.

I do like Alendark's suggestion about being first level, it seems to spread out the points without damaging the curve. It would also have seem to make a little more since in Role Playing terms, I have a hard time with going from beginer level to master level+ so fast. You would then come in having a profession that you already knew even if you had not mastered it yet. If there are mechanics reasons for this I can understand that too.

I know that when making a character I didn't really feel like I was making something to play that game as much as I was starting something for later. The first level abilities didn't seem useful enough, this was before having played and understanding some of the abilities. But a new player doesn't know that stuff yet. The first level abilities seemed like they could be useful but wouldn't necessarily, while the higher level abilities would be the ones I would be using all of the time. I now know this isn't necessarily true now.

Sorry about being so long winded

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:09 pm

While I can see people's desire to be more useful starting out, I have yet to play a single (decent) game where that has occured (LARP or otherwise). My starting characters have always been vastly underpowered. Yeah it sucks when everyone else is doing all these massive things and you have only a couple abilities, but it's a starting character. Starting characters are not meant to have abilities. They are designed for people to get comfortable in the system. If your character dies, you can apply points to the next character so after your first event you never need to play a 0th level character, thus avoiding the lack of usefulness feeling.

This is sort of like playing a video game. Is a game that fun when you have cool gear right away or is it cooler to gain it a bit later, once you have a clue what to do with it? I've never been a big fan of cheat codes obviously.

Post by Ug » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:26 pm

And FH can't be the first LARP to do that, why?

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:30 pm

Cause most games that do that suck. Ever played played a video game and immediately cheated? Wasn't Diablo a lot more fun before rushing? More options at character creation doesn't necessarily mean more fun.

Post by Ug » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:37 pm

I don't think giving people Level 1 would ruin their fun.

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:42 pm

no, but its an unnecessary addition, nonetheless. It's sort of like having 5 more starting points to buy equipment with. It'd be nice but it's not needed.

Post by Ug » Mon Aug 16, 2004 4:03 pm

From a lowbie perspective. I disagree.

Wyrmwrath · Post by **Wyrmwrath** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 4:06 pm

With a starting PC, you dont FEEL like the new and weak guy in town you ARE the new and weak guy in town. HOWEVER, you are SUPPOSED to be the new and weak guy in town! Role playing is about character developement and growth, not about what cool things you can do right away.

New PCs are barely better than farmers, minerss, and any other "peasent" because they ARE just trained peasents, no matter what financial class they are from. but they are supposed to be, or whats the poit of an advancement system? Lets alll just start at level 20 because to not limits my ability to role play....

If the fact that you have almost no skill limits your role playing, having skill will just hinder you even more. Playing the part doent mean playing the skills, it means playing the personality, the altered view point, the ficticious hatreds and biggotries. Anyone can play a bad ass warrior with the skill, try playing a loud, aggressive, war-like orc WITHOUT any "cool" skills. Then tell me about limited.

Post by Ug » Mon Aug 16, 2004 4:09 pm

I would actually like to see something more like:

Newb: Level 2

Gain 2 levels every event.

ie: I'd like to see newbies start with a bit more power, but I'd like to see progression slowed down a bit. I felt (and was pretty much) useless my first event, then all of a sudden on my second event I felt really powerful.

Sethreal · Post by **Sethreal** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 8:19 pm

I would agree with Brad on the part about starting out with a little more power. I think this because the new people are supposedly new from the Waste. I would think you would have to be able to hold your own if you survived the waste. Just my thought, but I like the progression as it is now.

Post by **GM_Chris** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 10:44 pm

As for onbe GM perspective I really dont care about what level people start at. As far as I am concerned you can all start at 20th level.

I would go so far as saying if this was a different LARP i wouldnt mind if people start at some sick super level.

Then again I get annoyed at D&D after about 3rd level. Personally I like 1st level games because people dont worry about what is on paper and they actually RP. Lot more fun IMO.

That is pretty much why I refuse to take skills at CARPS and I have yet to not feel usefull.

So I will talk to other GM's and maybe we can just take a vote and what ever people want about starting level we will do.

Chris

Post by Ug » Tue Aug 17, 2004 7:26 am

Starting at 20th level would be bad news, primarily because it would be more difficult for a newbie to learn all their skills, etc. However starting out with -some- points IMO would give a new player a bit more flexibility and feeling of "usefulness".

Todd · Post by **Todd** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:43 pm

Gain, didnt read all the posts, but....
My thought is to *Adjust the progression level (if people want more level distribution we could up the high end points) *Include the points it would cost for 1st Path, and Discipline *give a new pc that many points, and *start every one at lvl 1.
It doesnt make anyone more/less powerful it just makes it easier for noobs to keep track of "do I start as lvl 1, or lvl 0?"

~fin~