Ideal LARP Question 2

Post by **GM_Chris** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 1:43 pm

Aaron what is this ganked argument? I dont understand

I dont like 1 hour because time is distorted the same was at the sunset. Person A kills person B and then watches. Neither party has a watch but person A is positive that person B's group approached in 1 hour and 5 minutes yet person B is positive it was 55 minutes.

When ever time is in effect you have the same crap unless you had an indipendant person with a stop watch.

Heck we currently have arguments of "I hit person 1000000 times and the other person says no it was more like 1000 times"

As for Reid's example:
Person A kills person B

WHY DIDNT HE TAKE 5 seconds for a killing blow.

Ruling: You should have taken 5 seconds, no one had a clock, person lives.

You are creating a cheez effect that cannot exist. You gank a person thinking HA I can get them to bleed to death in 1 minute!

I have NEVER EVER in all my years of larping not seen a PvP encounter go down as follows:

I kill him
I kiling blow him
I chop off all their limbs
I feed the limbs\head body to pigs
I then feed the pigs to ogres
I charm the ogres to attack a dragon
I burn the dragon alive
I take the ashes and throw them into the sea after casting my no possible rez spell on the entire thing.

But in your example you have dippy do da killing a person 1 minute before sunrise? yes that is the perfect crime!

dier_cire · Post by **dier_cire** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:08 pm

Chris, the point of my little scenario was he wasn't given time to killing blow the guy via the fact that the guy's group is coming. And you've never seen someone get killed then the group runs in to save their buddy? I've seen it quite a few times from both sides.

By using the sunrise/sunset factor, you have double the chance at killing the guy. And double the chance for cheese.

Your counter of person A kills person B and watches... Why doesn't he killing blow the guy? He has an hour! And if he did sit there for the hour, most likely they checked the time and agreed on the start moment. Your counter is weak.

You have three rule nazis in agreement. This should be a sign.

And FYI, you have seen the encounter you described above (well damn near anyway). It's how Simon, my re-write of Conner, was killed.

Post by **GM_Chris** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:42 pm

Fine

It completely and totally blows my mind that the entire scientific community, heck school children can define day and night yet the brillent larping base is completely unable to. I am thinking of running an experiment of asking my nephew Marshal if it is day or night to see if he is able to figure it out.

I think this is how I would write the rule:

Day is defined as any time that the sun is completely above a level horizon; night is the rest of the time, including dawn and
twilight. In the case of any argument the ruling goes to the defending player.

So if you want to PvP a person dont do it around dusk and twilight.

To be honest though I am correct that no system is without cheese even your 1 hour so I have even a better way to determine death.

Death occurs when death tells you that you have died.

Basically I will make death a Gm decision. So you never know when you might bleed out. It might be in an hour it might be in 3 days. It will happen before game off.

Infact the more I think about it the more I like the death idea. I can have an NPC death monster that litterally goes around collecting people. Infact I could have death go to sleep at dawn and wake up at dusk

Atrum Draconus · Post by **Atrum Draconus** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:53 pm

So... you don't like time because the perception of time can be distorted, even though it only takes 1 person involved looking at a watch. But you like arbitrary timing because... it has built in distortion and you don't think that is going to cause more disagreements than a hard and fast measurable? Even though you say that there are disagreements with a hard and fast measurable?

Ask your nephew that question at the beginning of dusk and dawn. Then ask 10 other kids and see how many different answers you get. Most people would define dusk as day.

You say you don't really care if sunrise is 7:07 and the healing happens at 7:30. The person who's characters fate hinges on the balance of that ruling and the person that thought they just pulled of the perfect ganking will care.

Does that NPC death monster collect EVERYONE on the field that is in ngeatives at the time they go around, even people hiding out in the woods? Does that NPC ring a big bell and everyone knows that right then anyone in negatives is dead or do you collect each person one at a time giving the people that see death coming more time?

I'm not trying to be a jerkwad here, I'm trying to put forth questions about potential problems that will come up in the system you are proposing.

General Maximus · Post by **General Maximus** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:54 pm

To be honest, I wouldn't care if a peson chess's an 1 hr bleed to death time by 5 minutes or so. If a person is beat down and is not killed out right, but people can't find them in an hr, than there is something really the matter. I see the stituation of a person comeing to there bleed to death time and at the last minute is saved by friends a very very rare ccranence.
Most of the time, a person will be killed when in negtives or there friends will heal them. It would be very rare for a person just to sit for an hour to bleed to death. Unless the villian is twisted

But with the sunrise and sunset, people can plan PVP around that time to get have the most chance to kill a person. They beat the person down but get ran off before they could do the death blow. They might have killed the person anyway becasue the crossed the sunrise/set time limit.

My ganked comment is about being PVP right before game end/stop. A PVP using the rules to there advantage to kill a fellow person. That was the first thing I thought of when you posted rule suggestion.

Post by **GM_Chris** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:14 pm

Im sticking with my Gm walking around death idea.

Allows Gm's to have dramatic control of a scene and it stops rule people from arguing.

Post by **GM_Chris** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:18 pm

I also think a person is in no way allowed to phys rep their bodies while they are "bleeding" to death. There is no NPC time, and I almost question bathroom time, but I know someone will kill themselves or pee themselves and no one wants that.

I am also leaning toward people who are bleeding to death cannot be moved. This means that sooner or latter a person lieing on the ground is going to choose death over spending the night in the woods.

General Maximus · Post by **General Maximus** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:31 pm

I agree with you that a person needs to RP being dead. No NPCing or stuff like that.

If you go to a bleeding person cannot be moved, than I suggest the 1 hr time.

But, I get your point, forcing a person to chosse character death over a persons discomfort.

Hey, if you want to add another task for GM's to do, go for it. But I personaly don't see a need for it. This should be able to be worked out with in the rules allow the GM's to focus on Plot's and beating the crap of PC's. Just my 2 cents.

Post by **GM_Chris** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:35 pm

Im picturing a bit of a different game, but nothing I can really articulate

the death thing might work. I hate the 1 hour as you have no real idea how long an hour is. I might as well say you die in an hour or when the sun sets or rises which ever is longer for you.

Post by **GM-Mike** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:39 pm

WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS NOT A POLITICALLY CORRECT STATEMENT. IF THESE OFFEND YOU, STOP READING NOW

Then ask 10 other kids and see how many different answers you get.

Since I am a school psychologist, I can say this: if you get more than two different answers (day or night), then someone in the group is a tard.

Atrum Draconus · Post by **Atrum Draconus** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:56 pm

LOL nice Mike.

Atrum Draconus · Post by **Atrum Draconus** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 4:01 pm

I guess I'm not really understanding why you care about people bleeding to death if you don't really care about people being upset? Because an NPC walking around taking people under negatives as dead 1 by 1 is going to cause all kinds of favoritism whining. Just say at 0 they die, they can use no skills or be saved in any way. But if they choose to role play a death scene they have that option. Now THAT is simple, it doesn't lend itself to any timing arguments or favoritism whining. It gives you what you are looking for without making the rules clunky.

Post by **GM_Chris** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 4:09 pm

Erik you have a good point.

I really enjoy seeing people going to extreme measures to try and save aperson from the brink. I dont like resurection though.

I was chatting with Mike and I thought that if you say a person cannot move once they hit 0 and if they do move they die then the time it takes to bleed to death is up to the PC. They have the chocie to hang out as long as they can until they can be healed.

There still needs to be a limit. I am ok witht hat limit being game off.

Now if someone kills you near game off and there weer players to help you then the scene gets to be resolved.

Post by **GM_Chris** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 5:32 pm

I gave this more thought and you know the day night thing is not bad.

The problem is with inconsistent appeasing GM's

Since dieing to an NPC will never be a problem we will address only PvP.

If you kill someone and it is too close to figure out if it is the exact minue that a person lives or dies the rule goes blatenetly in the favor of the person who died.

Therefore you never ever get a person to try and cheese wizz the system. If you want to ensure a person dies and there is no debate then kill the person at midnight or noon.

Jaycen Blackhawk · Post by **Jaycen Blackhawk** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:55 am

GM_Chris wrote: I have NEVER EVER in all my years of larping not seen a PvP encounter go down as follows:

I kill him
I kiling blow him
I chop off all their limbs
I feed the limbs\head body to pigs
I then feed the pigs to ogres
I charm the ogres to attack a dragon
I burn the dragon alive
I take the ashes and throw them into the sea after casting my no possible rez spell on the entire thing.

Other than the pigs and dragon, this is the only way to kill someone at KANAR.

Until they complain to the GM's, BoD and their mom and it's all retconned.